Quote
panzer
Gorilla, why shouls you stay at gecko stable?

You can try to slim down Qtweb although Guenter said it is slow browser. You can use setup, zip or version or just stand-alone executable (11,7 MB and no twaking ). Do KM works with just stand-alone executable (.exe)? I have never tried that.

Another alternative: Lunascape 9Mb. World first triple engine browser.

Or why stay at Windows at all?

Kazahakase 1,4 Mb

Possibilities are endless. Explore it!

I am dual booting puppy linux215Ce and Win server 2000 ..
I will take a look at the browsers,,,
Thank you

Quote
panzer
Do KM works with just stand-alone executable (.exe)? I have never tried that.

Lunascape 9Mb. World first triple engine browser.


Kazahakase 1,4 Mb

1.) No. It is based on MFCembed.exe a test shell for Gecko. The construction joins the Windows API via MicrosoftFoundationClass with teh Gecko layout engine.

2.) An interesting concept.

3.) Kazekahaze has 3 engines also? They wanted to.

AFAIK Most browsers with more than one engine are from Japan.

Quote
guenter

Quote
panzer
Do KM works with just stand-alone executable (.exe)? I have never tried that.

Lunascape 9Mb. World first triple engine browser.


Kazahakase 1,4 Mb

1.) No. It is based on MFCembed.exe a test shell for Gecko. The construction joins the Windows API via MicrosoftFoundationClass with teh Gecko layout engine.

2.) An interesting concept.

3.) Kazekahaze has 3 engines also? They wanted to.

AFAIK Most browsers with more than one engine are from Japan.

Lunascape

Requirements

Supported OS: Windows 2000/XP/Vista
Minimum Installed Memory: 256MB (recommended: 512M
Internet Explorer 6 or later

I only have 224 MB of ram....

Quote
Gorilla no baka

Quote
guenter

Quote
panzer
Do KM works with just stand-alone executable (.exe)? I have never tried that.

Lunascape 9Mb. World first triple engine browser.


Kazahakase 1,4 Mb

1.) No. It is based on MFCembed.exe a test shell for Gecko. The construction joins the Windows API via MicrosoftFoundationClass with teh Gecko layout engine.

2.) An interesting concept.

3.) Kazekahaze has 3 engines also? They wanted to.

AFAIK Most browsers with more than one engine are from Japan.

Lunascape

Requirements

Supported OS: Windows 2000/XP/Vista
Minimum Installed Memory: 256MB (recommended: 512M
Internet Explorer 6 or later


28.5 MB extracted...highly dependence of IE and looks like is has inherited
vulnerabilities of both of search engines..


brrr...(scared shudder)

I only have 224 MB of ram....

You can also try the Hv3 browser which consists
only of a 2.5 Mb exe standalone in the Windows version.
There is also a Linux version and a pupget package for
Puppy Linux.
It is based on the Tkhtml3 rendering engine and
SEE (Simple ECMAScript Engine) to interpret scripts.
Available at
http://tkhtml.tcl.tk/hv3.html
For Linux there is a new Dillo, called Dillo 2,
based on FLTK 2, here :
http://www.fltk.org/links.php?V361 .
It is extremely fast, but has no javascript.
Size about 1.3 mb .
There seems to exist also a Dillo for Windows, but it seems
not to be stable enough yet, as they write.

Fred

Luna is much less hungry when it runs Gecko
I run it for comparing & checking pages - Luna 176 MB here K-Meleon 160 MB.

Most is used by system anyway. I have only 192 MB RAM.

Luna also uses SeaMonkey type modular GRE (nice to compare what dll are needed).
It seems to throw away space on unused Chrome though.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/16/2009 10:48PM by guenter.

the smallest i made kmeleon yet was 10.5mb. I just did it to mess around. it got all the icons and everything just not pretty looking lol

Quote
guenter
Is much less hungry when it runs Gecko
I run it for comparing & checking pages - Luna 176 MB here K-Meleon 160 MB.

Most is used by system anyway. I have only 192 MB RAM.

Luna also uses SeaMonkey type modular GRE (nice to compare what dll are needed).
It seems to throw away space on unused Chrome though.

I am sure a extremly small K-meleon can be made (One just under 7MB )

Of course will have no mouse gestures no so many plugins probably no skins a all and maybe with less files in the components folder .

(Right not my components folder is down to 7 MB and all the dll`s are not packed yet.
After i will be finishing with cleaning the unnecessary stuff i will be UPX-ing every dll and i am sure i can lower it down to 3-4 MB compressed and all that)

And the fact is I STILL HAVE MOUSE GESTURES i am still able to watch youtube videos and see television on line and stuff..
Point is :Two K-meleons shoud be made ..1 with extremly basic features still able to play movies sounds and all that with an extremly low foot print ,And one forthe normal users

Quote
Gorilla no baka
I am sure a extremly small K-meleon can be made (One just under 7MB )

(Right not my components folder is down to 7 MB and all the dll`s are not packed yet. After i will be finishing with cleaning the unnecessary stuff i will be UPX-ing every dll and i am sure i can lower it down to 3-4 MB compressed and all that)

And the fact is I STILL HAVE MOUSE GESTURES i am still able to watch youtube videos and see television on line and stuff..

Point is :Two K-meleons shoud be made ..1 with extremly basic features still able to play movies sounds and all that with an extremly low foot print ,And one forthe normal users

1.) IMHO 7 MB is realistic without too much loss of functions.
600 KB minimal chrome embed.jar & MicrosRSS as reader; 56 mb the smallest skin; All components.dll statically linked into K-Meleon.exe & upxed ca. 3 MB, all.xpt linked in one file & 2 dats 500 kb; Plus the dlls in root folder. You use a version that has only msvcp71.dll & msvcr71.dll. UPX all dll that can stand it.

kplugins just dispense with favorites and hotlist & UPX the rest.

2.) IMHO You have already deleted files needed for save and reliable functions.

3.) Mouse costs only a couple of kb

4.) Most PPL want a full browser - among them our devs hopefully and I
An extra mini browser would be done by PPL that want it, You are on the way - I can & will (merely) contribute "historic" info what and how some things and were done - A 0.8.2 with the bold features is below 10 MB. A 1.1 uses less 7.1.dll. If You can compile You will have Your 7 MB (or less) K-Meleon soon.

p.s. reeko124 - the described 0.8.2+ was at 9.2 MB



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 01/16/2009 10:49PM by guenter.

I reinstalled SRWare Iron which is basically google chrome I never really liked the browser because you can't modify it like you can k-meleon. Anyway on to my story installed it is 33.2 mb I stripped it down to 18.1mb I could have taken it down to about 11 but it wouldn't run with the iron.dll and iron.exe compressed. Just thought i would share that.

11 MB is good value - they use the latest MS dll & IMHO the dll are huge.
Thx for sharing the info.

Quote
guenter

Quote
Gorilla no baka
I am sure a extremly small K-meleon can be made (One just under 7MB )

(Right not my components folder is down to 7 MB and all the dll`s are not packed yet. After i will be finishing with cleaning the unnecessary stuff i will be UPX-ing every dll and i am sure i can lower it down to 3-4 MB compressed and all that)

And the fact is I STILL HAVE MOUSE GESTURES i am still able to watch youtube videos and see television on line and stuff..

Point is :Two K-meleons shoud be made ..1 with extremly basic features still able to play movies sounds and all that with an extremly low foot print ,And one forthe normal users

1.) IMHO 7 MB is realistic without too much loss of functions.
600 KB minimal chrome embed.jar & MicrosRSS as reader; 56 mb the smallest skin; All components.dll statically linked into K-Meleon.exe & upxed ca. 3 MB, all.xpt linked in one file & 2 dats 500 kb; Plus the dlls in root folder. You use a version that has only msvcp71.dll & msvcr71.dll. UPX all dll that can stand it.

kplugins just dispense with favorites and hotlist & UPX the rest.

2.) IMHO You have already deleted files needed for save and reliable functions.

3.) Mouse costs only a couple of kb

4.) Most PPL want a full browser - among them our devs hopefully and I
An extra mini browser would be done by PPL that want it, You are on the way - I can & will (merely) contribute "historic" info what and how some things and were done - A 0.8.2 with the bold features is below 10 MB. A 1.1 uses less 7.1.dll. If You can compile You will have Your 7 MB (or less) K-Meleon soon.

p.s. reeko124 - the described 0.8.2+ was at 9.2 MB

Yeah i can understend that most of the ppl wants a full broswser but the point is that the samne ppl will never use the whole features of the browser..Most of they do is opena up an email client view a prno page wich requires flash and java and that's all..You can compile this in 3.87 Mb the way i did with Opera@usb..Using a 50MB browser to do some regular stuff is a overkill like using a sledgehammer to break eggs for an omelette..
I don't wanna go as low as dillo, i do need flash and java...You know... My only regret is that Opera is not free source and you can not customize it as much as K-meleon...otherwise..Ah...an otherthing i d not like about K-meleon is the LIMITATION ON 8 PIPELINING REQUESTS...cAN IT BE TAKEN OUT OR IS IT FORBIDEN..??wHY HAS not anybody tried it yet..??

Thank you

Quote
Gorilla no baka
Using a 50MB browser to do some regular stuff is a overkill like using a sledgehammer to break eggs for an omelette..

I don't wanna go as low as dillo, i do need flash and java...You know...

My only regret is that Opera is not free source and you can not customize it as much as K-meleon... cAN IT BE TAKEN OUT OR IS IT FORBIDEN..??wHY HAS not anybody tried it yet..??

1.) That is why I am here - I want a browser only application to do all my surfing.

2.) Dillo is not yet far enough.

3.) It is not forbidden since unlike Opera K-Meleon is free software - You alter and recompile (probably only necko.dll is needed).

4.) You seem to be the first here that knew about it / else it is impossible / or unwanted for a sizable number of browsers (it uses more server resources, right?)

QTwebs executable is not 11mb its only 4.6mb. Even on there site it says 11. I wonder why? I also downloaded lunascape but I don't think I will use it. Its 30mb without the gecko and webkit plugin. I wasn't online when i installed it so when it asked to download those plugins I didn't get to. I'll do it just to let you guys know how it turns out lol.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/17/2009 03:34PM by reeko124.

Quote
reeko124
QTwebs executable is not 11mb its only 4.6mb. Even on there site it says 11.

I also downloaded lunascape but I don't think I will use it. Its 30mb without the gecko and webkit plugin. I wasn't online when i installed it so when it asked to download those plugins I didn't get to. I'll do it just to let you guys know how it turns out lol.

1.) QT is 11.5 MB on my HDD.
But they can have UPXed it since I downloaded it.

2.) For Luna You have to deduct all that is needed to have 3 shells plus xpcom.dll and MS runtimes - which should be in system folder also.
12 MB is my estimate.

The Gecko extension is interesting to keep. It will run with K-Meleon for GRE 1.9.
It has very redundant Firefox like chrome though.

got luna down to 21mb just removing stupid stuff. Haven't started getting into it yet. I don't know why i am doing that. I should be trying to strip k-meleon but 10.5mb seems to be the smallest I can get it.

By the way they must have because it is only 4.6mb on my end I just checked again.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/17/2009 05:09PM by reeko124.

luna with everytthing installed is 80mb. It won't stay on my comp long like that. plus it doesn't work with gecko on my computer but thats another post I am gonna make

Quote
guenter

Quote
Gorilla no baka
Using a 50MB browser to do some regular stuff is a overkill like using a sledgehammer to break eggs for an omelette..

I don't wanna go as low as dillo, i do need flash and java...You know...

My only regret is that Opera is not free source and you can not customize it as much as K-meleon... cAN IT BE TAKEN OUT OR IS IT FORBIDEN..??wHY HAS not anybody tried it yet..??

1.) That is why I am here - I want a browser only application to do all my surfing.

2.) Dillo is not yet far enough.

3.) It is not forbidden since unlike Opera K-Meleon is free software - You alter and recompile (probably only necko.dll is needed).

4.) You seem to be the first here that knew about it / else it is impossible / or unwanted for a sizable number of browsers (it uses more server resources, right?)

It's uses more server resurces aparently only.Think about it...
LET'S take a look at youtube :it is extremly bussy and loaded with huge melodies and video..Every time a normal user connects there using the normal network protocol and a normal internet connection and request a melody(audio-video stream
opens up few connections AND KEEPS THE OPPENED UNTILL THE GUYS HAS FINISHED DOWNLOADING THE MELODY,AND THE DEPENDING ON USERS TTL KEEPS IT A LITTLE BIT MORE..JUST IN CASE..That's fine if you live in 80's when the internet was not like nowadays...Ok...now picture the above scenario...only add 100 more millions of users per second which access the server from all of the corners of the planet..A NORMAL USER WILL KEEP OPENED THE FEW CONNECTIONS HE HAS UNTIL HE HAS FINISHED THE MELODY download because HE ONLY IS PERMITED FEW,and no pipelining if he uses IE...he is going to KEEP THE CONNECTIONS OPENED AND LOCKED FOR HIMSELF A LOT MORE A LOT MORE THAN a user that has enabled jumbo frames and comes with a customized browser that enables him to request like 300 pipelining request per second an an other few hundred in the total connection per server area..Now the customized browser guy is goin' to finish the melody download in 5 SECONDS and go away LIVING THE CONNECTIONS AVAILABE FOR THE OTHER GUYS AND THEREFORE MINIMALIZING THE IMPACT ON THE SERVER RESURCES ...whereas the regular browser guys are going to stick there on the server like a 500kg handicapated 2 years old kid forcing his mother to fill up his huge stomack (Otherwise they won't let her go and won't shut the f...ck up!!! ) the food in this case is the melody which a normal user needs to download and the kid is the browser with a normal internet connection

So you see.. in a modern world scenario the old network connection protocol is kind of obsolete..

K-Meleons exist in small numbers - try Your idea - if you can alter and recompile the resource.
It has no place in an official distro - but it can go as private hack.

p.s. The last word has the experiment - said the chemist and blew up the laboratory



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/18/2009 12:02AM by guenter.

Quote
guenter
K-Meleons exist in small numbers - try Your idea - if you can alter and recompile the resource.
It has no place in an official distro - but it can go as private hack.

p.s. The last word has the experiment - said the chemist and blew up the laboratory

I will..It is gonna take a while untill i will be proeficient in C++ (I am still learning)Also i do not even know what tools i need in order to compile it..
I mean i do have a c++dev stuff but i am running windows 2000 server and I guess the tools you guys are using are mainly for windows xp.

They are the same on XP

I have Windows XP & 2000 professional also.

As I said my assumption the resource You found wanted to hack alters necko.dll.

Mozilla compilation is well documented. But I do not know to compile.

Quote
guenter
They are the same on XP

I have Windows XP & 2000 professional also.

As I said my assumption the resource You found wanted to hack alters necko.dll.

Mozilla compilation is well documented. But I do not know to compile.

You know,,,I was thinking....Since K-meleon is a modular browser, it might be possible to download the code and compile only the parts we are interested in (In this case the network protocol or Necko.dll if that is the one that containes the max pipelining request and max connection per server settings)

So as i was saying...just take that part of protocol only compile it and voila... you will have the meanest browser around...
But then again I might be wrong,,,

It is not parts of K-Meleon but of the GRE (most likely).

SpiderMonkey project gives info on how to build parts.


Necko is the most likely wanted part to do Your idea.


I found this link at via Google-search-word "necko mozilla checkout"

p.s. My problem - I do not have the brains to try Your idea.
My ideas: build the newest script engines for current K-Meleon's GRE...

Never forget, the last word has the experiment, said the chemist & blew up the laboratory

Right or wrong try if You can = my motto.
Maybe there is a positive result.

Even without positive result - nothing is wrong if You hurt no one & do not spend money to try.

& I like positive results. Even ones derived from guesswork and trial :drool:



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/18/2009 11:46PM by guenter.

Quote
guenter
Myres ideas: build the newest script engines for current K-Meleon's GRE...
:

I have just finished slimmind the components folder..I have taken out 100 files out of it and now my components folder has only 40 files..

I will have to UPX-it and than next step is chrome folder...
I will upload a list of the files deleted along with the explanation on what's happening when you delete the files...It can be used to troubleshot K-meleon's problems as well...

So you're saying to build the newest scrip engine and than to try to upgrade the GRE??
This could be an ideia you know,,,

I hope You will find new borders for all of the project.
There are certainly more options that I have ever found.

Quote
guenter
I hope You will find new borders for all of the project.
There are certainly more options that I have ever found.

Bassicaly it all started as a curiosity...See How long can i mess around with the stuff till it crashes..
And then it turned ito a passion

Lol

Just a thought from an arm chair quarterback.

It seems that lately most browser devs are finally getting around to designing their browsers that they are slim, trim, faster and with less bloat. But still, to them I must say KM browsers are still the fastest.

Probably the new Opera 10 may be about as fast. But it still has far too much unnecessary eye candy in the way and taking up valuable screen real estate.

And still, KM browsers are fun and easy to customize seven way to Sunday.

Charlie

~~If it ain't broke, why screw it up?~~

Quote
caktus
Just a thought from an arm chair quarterback.

It seems that lately most browser devs are finally getting around to designing their browsers that they are slim, trim, faster and with less bloat. But still, to them I must say KM browsers are still the fastest.

Probably the new Opera 10 may be about as fast. But it still has far too much unnecessary eye candy in the way and taking up valuable screen real estate.

And still, KM browsers are fun and easy to customize seven way to Sunday.

That`s absolutly right....is exactly the same with K-meleon...I just found that you can delete almost everything in the chrome folder and the K-meleon will still work
without any fuss

edit:I got it that down by deleting unnecessary stuff inside ...I have not used any compression tool on it yet...

I got my chrome folder down to 126 KB and it is still working...How`s that about inutile stuff??
I am still able to watch bbc television online still able to watch youtube and dailymotions videoclips acces my email and post in forums...!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/21/2009 12:17PM by Gorilla no baka.

Quote
caktus
Probably the new Opera 10 may be about as fast. But it still has far too much unnecessary eye candy in the way and taking up valuable screen real estate.

There is no (unnecessary) eye candy (button, bar, panel) you can't easily remove/displace and tweak the GUI to save as much valuable screen real estate as you wish.
Therefore despite of using the same skin you will hardly find 2 advanced Opera users, whose Opera looks identic.
Opera has indeed many features I don't use myself. However features you don't use won't use up any resources. The main problem average users have with Opera is to tweak it according to their needs. I know what I'm speaking about since I use both K-M and Opera.

@Gorilla no baka

Your trimmed down K-M will load faster at startup that's out of question but I'm curious how much less resources (if any) your trimmed down K-M consumes during browsing.
As far as I'm concerned loading speed at startup isn't a big issue for me since I start the browser only once during a session.
As far as I've tested Günter's noXUL flavor, the only noticeable difference was the loading speed at startup.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/21/2009 01:53PM by Yogi.

Quote
Yogi

Quote
caktus
Probably the new Opera 10 may be about as fast. But it still has far too much unnecessary eye candy in the way and taking up valuable screen real estate.

There is no (unnecessary) eye candy (button, bar, panel) you can't easily remove/displace and tweak the GUI to save as much valuable screen real estate as you wish.
Therefore despite of using the same skin you will hardly find 2 advanced Opera users, whose Opera looks identic.
Opera has indeed many features I don't use myself. However features you don't use won't use up any resources. The main problem average users have with Opera is to tweak it according to their needs. I know what I'm speaking about since I use both K-M and Opera.

@Gorilla no baka

Your trimmed down K-M will load faster at startup that's out of question but I'm curious how much less resources (if any) your trimmed down K-M consumes during browsing.
As far as I'm concerned loading speed at startup isn't a big issue for me since I start the browser only once during a session.
As far as I've tested Günter's noXUL flavor, the only noticeable difference was the loading speed at startup.

7 tabs opened 27 MB ram...
My K-meleon now is only 5.69 Mb After I UPX-ed everything I could.

Is running perfect on my Windows server 2000

I still have to go back to the drawing board because i have just noticed i`ve lost my scroll bar (The one on the right side of the webpages..)
Nevertheless i still can scroll down using the mouse and the keyboard...