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Building K-Meleon on top of the Goanna engine 
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Re: [TEST BUILD] K-Meleon 74 on Goanna 2.2 (palemoon-26.5) for Win2000
Posted by: siria
Date: May 08, 2018 08:44PM

I find it still incredible that you can get this rather modern engine running. My highest hopes had been to some day get gecko10 fully running, before old systems were all completely dead yet, or -in the wildest dreams- perhaps something between gecko 12-24.

But considering this PM engine is even newer and more advanced as the original KM74-Gecko version, as you say, makes me wonder again: wouldn't it be easier to start with KM75 or KM75.1 as GUI right away? Because Dorian fixed a lot of bugs between KM74 and KM76, which you now must fix AGAIN. Somehow double work. And he also made huge progress towards use of original XPI-addons between 74-76, which you probably have to re-invent again too. After a several years gap between KM1.7alpha and KM74 my impression was always, he was mainly racing to catch up with long since contained engine features. Additionally he introduced some handy new macro features and toolbar stuff, which aren't fully finished yet.

For example it's great that you finally got in KM77 the site-specific useragents working, but in gecko that feature was working long before KM74/gecko24. This sort of catching up Dorian was doing between 74-76, and am just not sure if re-starting again with KM74 doesn't result in double work.
Then again, have no clue. Perhaps it has to do with resource limits on such old machines (100MB are real scary), or other reasons.

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Re: [TEST BUILD] K-Meleon 74 on Goanna 2.2 (palemoon-26.5) for Win2000
Posted by: Anonymous
Date: May 08, 2018 10:12PM

@siria:

May I chime in? Pale Moon was based on Gecko 24 in its versions 24.x, 25.x and 26.x. They then decided that Pale Moon was becoming outdated rather quickly and rebased their browser on Gecko 38 - and the result was Pale Moon 27.x. So they essentially skipped Gecko 31, which is what K-Meleon 75 was based on. So there is a direct counterpart for K-Meleon 74 and K-Meleon 76, but not really for K-Meleon 75. So this is why roytam1 most likely chose the K-Meleon 74 state of things for this build, as it is somewhat closer to Pale Moon 26.

Hope this explains things for you.

Since Dorian was never really seen again after K-Meleon 76 and since the Pale Moon developers are actively pursuing Pale Moon 28.x based on Gecko 52 (again skipping Gecko 45), the future of K-Meleon looks grim unless roytam1 manages to port it to Gecko 52 (which supported XP, yeah!). This is a very, very difficult task though, as no prior work has been done in this particular case.

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Re: [TEST BUILD] K-Meleon 74 on Goanna 2.2 (palemoon-26.5) for Win2000
Posted by: roytam1
Date: May 10, 2018 02:34PM

updated KM74-g22-20180506.testbin.7z and it loads non-secured pages now smiling smiley


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Re: [TEST BUILD] K-Meleon 74 on Goanna 2.2 (palemoon-26.5) for Win2000
Posted by: siria
Date: May 10, 2018 02:44PM

Quote
Anonymous
Pale Moon was based on Gecko 24 in its versions 24.x, 25.x and 26.x. They then decided that Pale Moon was becoming outdated rather quickly and rebased their browser on Gecko 38 - and the result was Pale Moon 27.x. So they essentially skipped Gecko 31, which is what K-Meleon 75 was based on. So there is a direct counterpart for K-Meleon 74 and K-Meleon 76, but not really for K-Meleon 75. (...)

Thanks for the handy little overview. Will try to memorize, just already so many many numbers to remember...

http://kmeleonbrowser.org/forum/read.php?19,146141,146142#msg-146142
Quote
anonymous
@siria
Site specific overrides should work for session, if there is no error evaluating this line in Console2:
Components.utils.import('resource://gre/modules/UserAgentOverrides.jsm').UserAgentOverrides.init();

If you mean for this KM74goanna build:
Confirm NO ERROR on my system!
That gives hope... So far in theory only, until the web-connection starts working too.
And there's also the prob how to get rid of the overriding custom UA-autoswitcher. If no other way I could modify its script to respect at least a global UA too, but would much prefer to get rid of the whole extension.

PS: if it doesn't harm your guys anonymity too much, perhaps consider using slightly different names? e.g. anonymous1+2 or anonymousK+P or AnonymousABC or whatever cool smiley



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/10/2018 03:18PM by siria.

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Re: [TEST BUILD] K-Meleon 74 on Goanna 2.2 (palemoon-26.5) for Win2000
Posted by: siria
Date: May 10, 2018 03:17PM

Quote
roytam1
updated KM74-g22-20180506.testbin.7z and it loads non-secured pages now smiling smiley

YES!! Great, a huge step forward! grinning smiley

And a new package almost as big as the full program, whow.
If you post a new complete version, I'd suggest to include the trouble-info macro, and the Phoenity skin or at least its 2 privbar pics in skins/default folder (and perhaps a write-protected file startupCache in the default profile folder?)

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Re: [TEST BUILD] K-Meleon 74 on Goanna 2.2 (palemoon-26.5) for Win2000
Posted by: siria
Date: May 10, 2018 04:49PM

_useragent_ howto
Quote
anonymous
Site specific overrides should work for session, if there is no error evaluating this line in Console2:
Components.utils.import('resource://gre/modules/UserAgentOverrides.jsm').UserAgentOverrides.init();

Could now do a real live test and: native site-exceptions really work FULLY! smiling smiley

Further tests:
- replaced custom switcher-macro "useragent.kmm" with "useragents2018.kmm"

In aboutconfig checked those prefs:
- general.useragent.site_specific_overrides = true
- right-click and RESET/delete: general.useragent.override
- kmeleon.privacy.useragent.Count = 0 (custom switcher pause)
- kmeleon.privacy.useragent.nouseragent = false (custom switcher pref)

After restart opened ErrorConsole and fed it this line again (evaluate-button):
Components.utils.import('resource://gre/modules/UserAgentOverrides.jsm').UserAgentOverrides.init();

Defined a site-exception using the Mozilla-prefs

Works all as expected now! That custom-switcher-extension in components folder (KmeleonMain.js) doesn't seem to interfere anymore. Now wondering if it can be removed completely or not...

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Re: [TEST BUILD] K-Meleon 74 on Goanna 2.2 (palemoon-26.5) for Win2000
Posted by: hermes
Date: May 10, 2018 07:11PM

What I'm doing wrong? sad smiley

1. The set was taken from http://o.rthost.cf/gpc/files1.rt/KM74-g22-20180429.win2000.7z
2. And additional set from http://o.rthost.cf/gpc/files1.rt/KM74-g22-20180506.testbin.7z
3. Mix them, add second to first.

and...

K-Meleon
----------------------------
K-Meleon failed to initialize. Please reinstall.
----------------------------
OK

Win98 SE + KERNEL EX v.4.5.2

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Re: [TEST BUILD] K-Meleon 74 on Goanna 2.2 (palemoon-26.5) for Win2000
Posted by: siria
Date: May 10, 2018 07:59PM

@hermes:
First guess, from plenty experience:
You renamed the K-Meleon path and forgot that KernelEx uses a list with paths?? cool smiley

Second guess:
Or downloaded old versions from cache?
Both paths were replaced with the same name several times.
And not sure if Kex452 is enough, have not tried this version.
Last week I've added Kex2016.17, but must say the negative effects seem more as the positive ones. Therefore, not sure if I'll keep it. But the one big advantage is that 7-zip can open omni.ja in advanced 7z format now.
Have also messed around with some dll's.
And have toggled some KM prefs in aboutconfig.
And the default skin produces more frequent crashes as older skins (some commands in those are probably obsolete)
Have tried to disable all non-default macros and extensions, but some are complicated and not sure if there are remnants.
And added a few non-intrusive macros of mine (troubleshooting_prefs, useragents2018, priv3buttons, menuplus...)

PS:
the 'real' useragent is now reported as:
Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 5.0; rv:2.2) Goanna/20140105 K-Meleon/74.0

general.useragent.compatMode.gecko = true
general.useragent.compatMode.firefox = true
Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 5.0; rv:38.9) Gecko/20100101 Goanna/2.2 Firefox/38.9 K-Meleon/74.0



Edited 4 time(s). Last edit at 05/12/2018 07:06AM by siria.

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Re: [TEST BUILD] K-Meleon 74 on Goanna 2.2 (palemoon-26.5) for Win2000
Posted by: roytam1
Date: May 11, 2018 02:49AM

Quote
hermes
What I'm doing wrong? sad smiley

1. The set was taken from http://o.rthost.cf/gpc/files1.rt/KM74-g22-20180429.win2000.7z
2. And additional set from http://o.rthost.cf/gpc/files1.rt/KM74-g22-20180506.testbin.7z
3. Mix them, add second to first.

and...

K-Meleon
----------------------------
K-Meleon failed to initialize. Please reinstall.
----------------------------
OK

Win98 SE + KERNEL EX v.4.5.2

you may need to set kex mode manually

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Re: [TEST BUILD] K-Meleon 74 on Goanna 2.2 (palemoon-26.5) for Win2000
Posted by: roytam1
Date: May 11, 2018 07:21AM

Just in case if it needs clarification, there is K-Meleon 74 Goanna 2.2 for Win2000 only.
For KM74g22 on Win9X-KEx, since KernelEx itself looks like black magic to me and lack of reliable debugging methods, I don't know if I can fix all bugs happening on KEx (on both KM and KEx sides) to give a stable browsing experiences on Win9X.

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Re: [TEST BUILD] K-Meleon 74 on Goanna 2.2 (palemoon-26.5) for Win2000
Posted by: siria
Date: May 11, 2018 08:38AM

Don't worry, KernelEx users are aware this great tool only helps for many, not all Apps. And if it fails, there's always a bit more hope for a few more possible Win9X update-tweaks...

But Kex' and your White Magic is strong, LOL! grinning smiley
It has gotten us already far beyond the previous level of hope for a semi-modern browser! To me it seems, currently a HUGE technical prob is httpS-browsing, this would be a killer function. But seeing that you're an expert in that area, and working very hard at it currently, am not worrying about this one too much. And if you manage to break this barrier wall, you've pushed this project across the critical line!

A bunch of 'normal' bugs is waiting in the line too, e.g. history function, but from past experience, about 95% of bugs happen on younger systems too. If not fixable, yeah that happens. KM1.6 has some flaws too, and users keep fiddling to find workarounds or live with it. Macros can help a big deal with that. Another prob is stability, oh well. Yeah... some things get bothersome in daily use, but there's still a huge difference of getting something not at all or only to some degree.

Overall experience:
if an app fails despite KernelEx, it usually fails big time at initial start already! Other shortcomings are rare, and more or less annoying but "usually" no killer probs. Sadly not always.

But you're right, my other post sounds too sure. Have it reworded to "Win2000/??98SE??"



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/11/2018 01:44PM by siria.

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Re: [TEST BUILD] K-Meleon 74 on Goanna 2.2 (palemoon-26.5) for Win2000
Posted by: hermes
Date: May 11, 2018 04:11PM

Thank you, now I understood until end smiling smiley .
...
To make it easier for others, I recorded a video (~4 min) what to do (entirely). For "clean" PC.

(direct link) https://getfile.dokpub.com/yandex/get/https://yadi.sk/d/EbXqpAki3VjNVd (~422 KB)



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/11/2018 04:12PM by hermes.

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Re: [TEST BUILD] K-Meleon 74 on Goanna 2.2 (palemoon-26.5) for Win2000
Posted by: siria
Date: May 11, 2018 10:36PM

I can open HTTPS!!!!

LOL! Okay, it's a bit cheating:
have copied over all 3 *.db files from my RetroRoyFox3.6 profile cool smiley
Then opened this page:
https://msfn.org/board/forum/8-windows-9xme/

Actually had tried something like that before, but had overlooked it's 3 files, and only taken 2. And not sure if they were from my KM1.6 only. But doesn't matter: that's a workaround win98 users surely can live with.

But it's excrutiatingly sloooooooooow, takes 10-20x longer as with KM1.6
That's not httpS related, am sure it's just some normal bug. Because just about everything is extremely slow, even if there's zero reason. For example loading my LOCAL link list, which loads in half a second in KM1.6. KM74 needs 15 seconds. And even setting the browser offline, no difference. The funny thing is, loading time depends from the number of contained links! It's proportional. The original file has about 130 links, a shorter test file about 10-20.
Although have figured out there exist 3 "prefetch" prefs, those don't help a thing. And if I change all links to http only, no difference either.
But also XUL windows are suspiciously slow, although not quite as extreme.

A huge prob is also that something makes KM74goa crash so often yet, and irregular. But not reproducable always, not reliably. Out-of-box its worst. Enabling just the menubar seems only possible using F2>toolbar. Sometimes an older skin seems to improve crashing, sometimes first opening another tab before calling e.g. View>Toolbars.

And since yesterday all XUL windows have extremely small font. Could be related to testbin3, but not sure. Anyone else?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/11/2018 10:39PM by siria.

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Re: [TEST BUILD] K-Meleon 74 on Goanna 2.2 (palemoon-26.5) for Win2000
Posted by: siria
Date: May 12, 2018 02:18AM

Looks like xpi-addons are partly working too, similar to KM76 smiling smiley
That means without native menus and buttons, but macros can help.
(And currently yet the overall speed/freeze bug)

Does the old included jar-extension ExException/ExExPermission, in Tools menu, work for others? How?

For me not, but could be my fault, have done too much experimenting of all sorts. Anyway, after first attempts quickly decided to test the normal Firefox addon instead. Again, at first no luck, and fiddled with versions in install.rdf, allowing it for KM+FF+PM all version 1.0-99. It worked! Next step: added Merlins old hack to pre-fill the Domain field with the current site and - worked too! Next, just for testing denied stylesheets on kmeleonbrowser.org, and - worked too! Now tried to remove that exception again - and ran into freezes, sigh. But seemed to be only visually, after closing the editor window in the taskbar, then opening it again, the stored line was gone again.
Of course this addon is just an sqlite-editor, not the most complicated one.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/12/2018 02:20AM by siria.

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Re: [TEST BUILD] K-Meleon 74 on Goanna 2.2 (palemoon-26.5) for Win2000
Posted by: roytam1
Date: May 12, 2018 03:07PM

Quote
siria
I can open HTTPS!!!!

LOL! Okay, it's a bit cheating:
have copied over all 3 *.db files from my RetroRoyFox3.6 profile cool smiley
Then opened this page:
https://msfn.org/board/forum/8-windows-9xme/

Actually had tried something like that before, but had overlooked it's 3 files, and only taken 2. And not sure if they were from my KM1.6 only. But doesn't matter: that's a workaround win98 users surely can live with.

But it's excrutiatingly sloooooooooow, takes 10-20x longer as with KM1.6
That's not httpS related, am sure it's just some normal bug. Because just about everything is extremely slow, even if there's zero reason. For example loading my LOCAL link list, which loads in half a second in KM1.6. KM74 needs 15 seconds. And even setting the browser offline, no difference. The funny thing is, loading time depends from the number of contained links! It's proportional. The original file has about 130 links, a shorter test file about 10-20.
Although have figured out there exist 3 "prefetch" prefs, those don't help a thing. And if I change all links to http only, no difference either.
But also XUL windows are suspiciously slow, although not quite as extreme.

A huge prob is also that something makes KM74goa crash so often yet, and irregular. But not reproducable always, not reliably. Out-of-box its worst. Enabling just the menubar seems only possible using F2>toolbar. Sometimes an older skin seems to improve crashing, sometimes first opening another tab before calling e.g. View>Toolbars.

And since yesterday all XUL windows have extremely small font. Could be related to testbin3, but not sure. Anyone else?
oh yeah, that works.


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Re: [TEST BUILD] K-Meleon 74 on Goanna 2.2 (palemoon-26.5) for Win2000
Posted by: siria
Date: May 12, 2018 04:48PM

Actually, it's *almost* ready for daily use now smiling smiley
Main probs still XUL font, missing history, and URL-bar history has some prob (also in KM1.6), etc...
And slowness, of course depending on page content, but there must be more reasons. Some strange bugs involved too, because of this:

Just opening a new empty tab takes suspiciously longer as usual, and opening F2 kmprefs too. And after restarts, opening a second tab often prevents crashing when trying to show the toolbars menu. Not always, can't nail it down reliable+reproducable, but often when right-clicking in a free toolbar space.
Especially suspicious I find this:

http://kmeleonbrowser.org/forum/file.php?19,file=1750,filename=test-linkpage_KM74goa22_98SE.htm

Attached is an extremely stripped down version of my links homepage. Have removed all tables, style-gimmicks etc., just to test the loading times. That time depends exactly on the number of links contained, easy to test when multiplying them 10x in the source code.
Even when the whole browser is set to OFFLINE.

Have suspected as culprits perhaps link-prefetching, DNS-prefetching, adblockers, some malware/phishing/other tracking prefs, security prefs, but there are just so countless many... sad smiley



Edited 4 time(s). Last edit at 05/12/2018 05:20PM by siria.

Attachments: test-linkpage_KM74goa22_98SE.htm (1.1 KB)  
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Re: [TEST BUILD] K-Meleon 74 on Goanna 2.2 (palemoon-26.5) for Win2000
Posted by: siria
Date: May 12, 2018 05:20PM

just saw this on MSFN:
https://msfn.org/board/topic/177751-backporting-newer-browsers-to-windows-9x/
Quote
roytam1
NSS db files in profile folder doesn't able to create correctly in KernelEx, after copying db files from profile created in 2000/XP, it works.

Mine were created in 98SE, just using Retrozilla 3.6
That's an important little detail for user with only 1 OS smiling smiley

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Re: [TEST BUILD] K-Meleon 74 on Goanna 2.2 (palemoon-26.5) for Win2000
Posted by: hermes
Date: May 12, 2018 06:38PM

In the video from the post above:
http://kmeleonbrowser.org/forum/read.php?19,146040,146160#msg-146160
everything turned out thanks to the double launch (all in 98 SE) smiling smiley.

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Re: [TEST BUILD] K-Meleon 74 on Goanna 2.2 (palemoon-26.5) for Win2000
Posted by: siria
Date: May 12, 2018 09:37PM

Wondering if anyone else gets that Console Error too in 98SE, or is it just my system or settings?

While creating services from category 'profile-after-change', could not create service for entry 'Disk Space Watcher Service', contract ID '@mozilla.org/toolkit/disk-space-watcher;1'



What's crazy, must already use KM74g22 half the time of real browsing, in a parallel session to KM1.6. And it works rather well so far!

For example looked at MSFN forum today, with KM1.6 (FF3.5), and as so often, the first posts of a page are cropped and invisible :
https://msfn.org/board/topic/177125-my-build-of-new-moon-temp-name-aka-pale-moon-for-xp/?page=52
No idea why, but with KM1.6 between those 2 lines the page gets split, the upper part invisible:
- Move --enable-tests out of Python configure and flip the default. (927868e8b)
- Bug 1411415. (66aa6b595)

==> MSFN forcing me to use a modern browser!
Even though the cyphers still work there.

Now reading a bit through MSFN with a modern browser (Op12,FF9,KM74), and it contains some interesting links to the PaleMoon forum (darn, have missed the most dramaFun today, now it's gone - Argh! :-P)
Next, trying to read the links to the NoScript-thread in PM, but: cypher-errors in KM1.6
==> PM-forum forcing me to use a modern browser too!
Next, that forum has some interesting links to github, but: cypher-errors in KM1.6
==> GITHUB forcing me to use a modern browser too!
Next, I come across links to the Mozilla Site. Most of it still works, but a few parts have already started to give cypher-errors in KM1.6 too. And so it goes on, sigh...

Yeah I could use Opera12 or Firefox9 to read those, and if it were only for cyphers and not for modern CSS probs too, also Retrozilla (FF2/FF3.6)
But: I just need my Macros! And absolutely need the PrivBar, plus a bunch more buttons for finetuning permissions. Media, stylesheets, script-files, subdocuments, etc. And of course a useragent-menu. And my temp-css-Toggle, etc.

And so it comes that KM74-g22 is already in productive use now, even in pre-alpha stage smiling smiley
Am slowly copying over custom stuff from KM1.6 when needing something, one by one. So far everything macro-related works amazingly fine smiling smiley And no crashes, as long as I'm not right-clicking a free toolbar space, but that's no prob. Am not used to that method anyway, using since years a custom button for the same action (left-click to edit buttons, right-click for toolbars menu)

(PS roytam: SilverMoon sounds perfect to me)

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Re: [TEST BUILD] K-Meleon 74 on Goanna 2.2 (palemoon-26.5) for Win2000
Posted by: siria
Date: May 12, 2018 09:39PM

Quote
hermes
In the video from the post above:
http://kmeleonbrowser.org/forum/read.php?19,146040,146160#msg-146160
everything turned out thanks to the double launch (all in 98 SE) smiling smiley.

Riddling if I understand correctly: can you access httpS sites with KM74 without copying over the *.db files from another browser/profile?

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Re: [TEST BUILD] K-Meleon 74 on Goanna 2.2 (palemoon-26.5) for Win2000
Posted by: roytam1
Date: May 12, 2018 11:44PM

Quote
siria
Actually, it's *almost* ready for daily use now smiling smiley
Main probs still XUL font, missing history, and URL-bar history has some prob (also in KM1.6), etc...
And slowness, of course depending on page content, but there must be more reasons. Some strange bugs involved too, because of this:

Just opening a new empty tab takes suspiciously longer as usual, and opening F2 kmprefs too. And after restarts, opening a second tab often prevents crashing when trying to show the toolbars menu. Not always, can't nail it down reliable+reproducable, but often when right-clicking in a free toolbar space.
Especially suspicious I find this:

http://kmeleonbrowser.org/forum/file.php?19,file=1750,filename=test-linkpage_KM74goa22_98SE.htm

Attached is an extremely stripped down version of my links homepage. Have removed all tables, style-gimmicks etc., just to test the loading times. That time depends exactly on the number of links contained, easy to test when multiplying them 10x in the source code.
Even when the whole browser is set to OFFLINE.

Have suspected as culprits perhaps link-prefetching, DNS-prefetching, adblockers, some malware/phishing/other tracking prefs, security prefs, but there are just so countless many... sad smiley

for history, try this kplugin:
http://o.rthost.cf/gpc/files1.rt/KM74-g22-kplugin-history.7z

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Re: [TEST BUILD] K-Meleon 74 on Goanna 2.2 (palemoon-26.5) for Win2000
Posted by: siria
Date: May 13, 2018 12:51AM

Quote
roytam1
for history, try this kplugin:
http://o.rthost.cf/gpc/files1.rt/KM74-g22-kplugin-history.7z

Thank you, tried it. So far no luck:
popup-message "Could not load Mozilla history!"

That is when using the "old" button command.
When using the menu it pops up a little xul box GUI without any entries, the same as without the plugin.
Have tried to play with settings, but there are so many again... and probably interfering plugin+places methods...

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Re: [TEST BUILD] K-Meleon 74 on Goanna 2.2 (palemoon-26.5) for Win2000
Posted by: anonymous
Date: May 13, 2018 10:44AM

@siria
JujuLand reported a 'Disk Space Watcher Service' error using Gecko 24. It was fixed a few days later.

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Re: [TEST BUILD] K-Meleon 74 on Goanna 2.2 (palemoon-26.5) for Win2000
Posted by: siria
Date: May 13, 2018 01:44PM

Quote
anonymous
JujuLand reported a 'Disk Space Watcher Service' error using Gecko 24. It was fixed a few days later.

Thanks for the tip and link!
Okay, so now I've added the pref:
"kmeleon.install_firefox_extension = true"
YES, the console error about diskspace is gone now! Good.

Had hoped that error might also be responsible for any bugs, but doesn't seem to fix anything, only the console.

That pref is obviously not needed to install or run xpi-additions, or the one addon I've installed previously wouldn't have worked. And guess this Console error existed already before it. Perhaps that pref is (was?) just a workaround for the bunch of KM74 probs.

In KM76-Goanna roytam has fixed something related to it:
http://kmeleonbrowser.org/forum/read.php?19,143253,143436#msg-143436
http://kmeleonbrowser.org/forum/read.php?19,143253,143442#msg-143442
(the stuff about dates and versions seems to affect KM74 too)

PS: after adding that pref, at first Restart a message suddenly popped up that KM checks for (addon?) updates or compatibility or such! Have canceled it immediately, hate such automatic stuff which doesn't even ask first. The prob is, this happened despite I had long since blocked in aboutconfig, or at least tried to block, all possible prefs for all sorts of auto-update/report/download/protect/safebrowsing-stuff to False, and there's a scary mass of them. Also had set dozens of http-URLs to xxxhttp. Had noticed yesterday already, quite surprised too, that in aboutPreferences a checkbox for KM auto-update was still checked anyway, and UNchecked it. Not yet found out which of the plenty update prefs are affected by it.
But some pref-names aren't fully self-explaining, for example "extensions.update.notifyUser". Must look those up, whether it means "update or not" or the opposite "update silently or not"



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 05/13/2018 01:57PM by siria.

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Re: [TEST BUILD] K-Meleon 74 on Goanna 2.2 (palemoon-26.5) for Win2000
Posted by: hermes
Date: May 13, 2018 03:01PM

Quote
siria
Quote
hermes
In the video from the post above:
http://kmeleonbrowser.org/forum/read.php?19,146040,146160#msg-146160
everything turned out thanks to the double launch (all in 98 SE) smiling smiley.

Riddling if I understand correctly: can you access httpS sites with KM74 without copying over the *.db files from another browser/profile?

Fortunately, all basic features works.

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Re: [TEST BUILD] K-Meleon 74 on Goanna 2.2 (palemoon-26.5) for Win2000
Posted by: siria
Date: May 13, 2018 08:29PM

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hermes
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siria
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hermes
In the video from the post above:
http://kmeleonbrowser.org/forum/read.php?19,146040,146160#msg-146160
everything turned out thanks to the double launch (all in 98 SE) smiling smiley.

Riddling if I understand correctly: can you access httpS sites with KM74 without copying over the *.db files from another browser/profile?

Fortunately, all basic features works.

Okay, so it looks like my various attempts at a KernelEx Update, the entailing probs with old apps and lots of fiddling attempts seriously damaged something sad smiley

Did some more tests now:
Creating a new profile for retrozilla-FF3.6 has the same prob now!
At first start "could not initialize security applications etc" and the db-files missing in the new profile. After a restart 2 files get created but key3.db still missing. No connection to httpS.
This was working before those KernelEx struggles!
And the 3 db files which were created before it still work today, and also their copy in KM74goa.
Tried again various Kex settings for the exe, when creating a new profile, but the older the worse. If Kex is disabled, it crashes even before creating the new profile folder.

Same test for my good old KM1.6, which has worked fine and still does:
Same prob now, NEW profile creation cannot create a key3.db anymore!

Testing retrozilla-FF2.1 :
This one still works! But as noted before, at the time of profile-CREATION the exe must be set to KernelEx all "disabled". Afterwards that settings doesn't matter anymore.

Now tried copying those now FF2-db-files in the new KM1.6 profile:
Basically works too. But not quite sure how well, out of 5 test pages 2 wanted a Cert-Exception, and the github-page gave cypher errors again. Perhaps it was one of those random cases - on some https-sites it seems pure luck if they work or not, sometimes yes, sometimes no. The best chance for those is right after a browser start, but once they fail the game is over and restart needed.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/13/2018 08:32PM by siria.

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Re: [TEST BUILD] K-Meleon 74 on Goanna 2.2 (palemoon-26.5) for Win2000
Posted by: anonymous
Date: May 13, 2018 09:02PM

@siria
No. Not just a preference setting. It was in Gecko binaries.

@RoyTam1
BUG 895964

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Re: [TEST BUILD] K-Meleon 74 on Goanna 2.2 (palemoon-26.5) for Win2000
Posted by: siria
Date: May 14, 2018 05:49PM

Found the reason for my tiny XUL fonts: it's a Mozilla 'feature'!
Not OS-related and not KM related.
Although guess KM could probably fix it.
More important, finally found a workaround too:

https://www.reddit.com/r/waterfox/comments/7ga6pe/increasing_minimum_font_size_on_web_pages_and/
Defining fonts for XUL-standalone windows in profile/chrome/userChrome.css!

That works in KM too, to my surprise. Have wasted far too much time for that stuff again, and finally realized the base prob is that standalone xul-windows just ignore the min-font size. Funnily, if opened in a normal tab, the exact same URLs show okay. So in my eyes this demonstrates it's a bug, but that's a long story, may post more later in another topic.

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Re: [TEST BUILD] K-Meleon 74 on Goanna 2.2 (palemoon-26.5) for Win2000
Posted by: siria
Date: May 14, 2018 06:16PM

Another very long story, the httpS/key3.db creation prob for KM74 with 98SE-KernelEx:
Looks like it works for Hermes, but not for me. So this depends strongly from the individual updates and settings. This info made me test again with some browsers I had installed BEFORE those messy Kernelex update attempts, what happens when creating a NEW profile NOW?

(just on MY confused system: )
KM1.6: can NOT create key3 anymore! (shock)
Firefox-9: can NOT create key3 anymore
Retrozilla-FF3.6: can NOT create key3 anymore
Retrozilla-FF2.1: This one still works.

Also copying over those new FF2.1 keys into other browsers helps too, although not sure how well. A quick test with 5 httpS pages wanted for 2 a cert-exception confirmed (server prob?), another page, github, gave cypher errors (Happens rather often and randomly with some sites, only a restart helps then - sometimes.)

So started digging around again...
It seems awhile ago the MSFN people had already managed to get a native KM74_31 running on win98! IIRC KM74_31 were the first attempts with Gecko31.
Just faaar too slow for normal use (same prob with Goanna here, but feels like a fixable bug to me, not just overload.) At middle of page here:
https://msfn.org/board/topic/173233-kernelex-45-core-updates-45201617/?page=29

MSFN folks at first got the usual 'fails to initialize' error too, but at last they got it running.

That stuff is over my head, only understood the hint to disable Kex on some DLLs, so I tried setting 3 OLE-DLLs in win/system folder to "KernelEx" disabled (unicows was long since, and couldn't find the first one).

(just on MY confused system: )
=> Retrozilla-FF3.6 can now create its own keys again. But still crashing if Kex disabled on its exe.
Otherwise no change yet, not for KM1.6 + KM74xxx

Prob is, messing with DLLs can easily produce other side effects for other Apps. Of course, can always try to restore my system as it was before, but takes much time meanwhile, and still hesitating due to better 7z version.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/15/2018 02:07PM by siria.

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Re: [TEST BUILD] K-Meleon 74 on Goanna 2.2 (palemoon-26.5) for Win2000
Posted by: hermes
Date: May 15, 2018 09:53AM

@siria
I can recommend, before each experiment with a stable system, to shoot a full image of system partition. Under 9x (when rebooting into MS-DOS), Norton Ghost (old version) is ideal for these purposes.
...
Can lay out a binary (if necessary). He fits onto a floppy disk.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/15/2018 02:56PM by hermes.

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