Development :
K-Meleon Web Browser Forum
CNET contacted me about an article that they are working on that includes questions about K-Meleon. Can someone from the current development team who could speak to them for the article contact me so I can get you in contact with them? E-mail me at my Yahoo e-mail (andrewimutch)
Devs and EC European translators (where i know mail) have Stephen Shankland's mail text with my comment about end user support and choice screen.
Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 02/26/2010 03:30PM by guenter.
I have send it to Dorian, and what I think of this (and to amutch, guenter, and all other devs)
I'm not the one which will answer, but in the mail I tell all what I think about these journalist (are-they really journalist ?)
I have send it in french, no problem to understand ?
A+
Mozilla/5.0 (x11; U; Linux x86_64; fr-FR; rv:38.0) Gecko/20100101 Ubuntu/12.04 K-Meleon/76.0
Web: http://jujuland.pagesperso-orange.fr/
Mail : alain [dot] aupeix [at] wanadoo [dot] fr
Ubuntu 12.04 - Gramps 3.4.9 - Harbour 3.2.0 - Hwgui 2.20-3 - K-Meleon 76.0 rc
None.
p.s. Stephen Shankland, senior writer at CNET News"
Deep Tech blog: http://news.cnet.com/deep-tech/
AFAIK You will find his coverage on Monday.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/26/2010 05:17PM by guenter.
I have read that the view order is aleatory, but just for the last 6 browsers, so you always arrive on the same screen with IE8, Opera, Firefox, Chrome, and Safari.
In the first screen it's not said that all the browsers aren't viewed in the same page. And we always arrive in this second screen where a great part of users won't see that there are others browsers.
It' really a scandal !!! That why Maxthon have respond.
Have we joined EC for this point ?
A+
Mozilla/5.0 (x11; U; Linux x86_64; fr-FR; rv:38.0) Gecko/20100101 Ubuntu/12.04 K-Meleon/76.0
Web: http://jujuland.pagesperso-orange.fr/
Mail : alain [dot] aupeix [at] wanadoo [dot] fr
Ubuntu 12.04 - Gramps 3.4.9 - Harbour 3.2.0 - Hwgui 2.20-3 - K-Meleon 76.0 rc
Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 02/26/2010 05:22PM by JujuLand.
I just wrote to Stephen Shankland my views on the merits. Although the ballot screen does not apply to Russian, but we have an opinion about this project and how it is implemented.
My blog about K-Meleon
http://kmeleon-ru.blogspot.com/
I'm also concerned about all the other browser that doesn't figure in the list, and how they will be completely left out.
Anyways, the effects are showing up already. :O
1.) I much agree - it would be easy to include more browsers if the ballot screen would scroll down normally.
2.) Maybe add Autoswitcher to 1.5.4 else many PPL will think that it is K-Meleon's fault that pages like Hotmail... do not work. Else we may get swamped with complaints.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/26/2010 08:03PM by guenter.
But this growth is not really due only to the Browser Choice window, because this is in the same time that released of the new versions 1.5.4 RC and 1.6.0a.
K-Meleon in Spanish
no no, desga those are download statistics for the project page(files on kmeleon sf project) not website, 1.5.4rc and 1.6 are not yet on the project download at sf files and are hosted on the kmeleon website itself. so this increase is probably related to the choice screen. the choice srcreen install button sends directly to 1.5.3 download
I hope someone will ask the CNET guy also to test K-Meleon 1.6
So, this is an article:
http://news.cnet.com/8301-30685_3-20000111-264.html
My blog about K-Meleon
http://kmeleon-ru.blogspot.com/
That is a very interesting article.
Personally I have tried Maxthon, SlimBrowser, Greenbrowser, Avant, Opera, and others now abandoned projects. Yes I have tried a lot of browsers. Most of those browser are IE based programs. I can not believe that the Maxthon representative says that can take Opera's place in the market? Opera is a robust browser with a large community. Currently Maxthon needs IE, and if you are using an old Windows OS you can't upgrade IE so...
1.) EU gives obscure browsers a big chance by Stephen Shankland
I do not like the word: obscure
But IMHO You are right - he gives a balanced view of the pros and cons.
2.)Maxton with Gecko is called Orca. // sorry Avant see jsnj's coorection below.
Maxton with webkit will show up soon.
Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 03/06/2010 03:07AM by guenter.
Lesser players seek browser choice prominence by Stephen Shankland quotes browser vendors that it "Is clear that the final choice screen design leaves the vast majority of users unaware that there are more than five browsers to choose from. This is inconsistent with the EU Commissions' stated goal for the choice screen--to provide European consumers with 'information on the 12 most widely-used Web browsers and to allow users to easily download and install one or more of these Web browsers,'"
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/05/2010 02:40PM by guenter.
Talking about press article, exist this old wiki page: PressCenter, that could be updated with some of the new articles about K-Meleon.
K-Meleon in Spanish
You mean Avant w/Gecko is Orca
Sorry and thx for correction.
But who is to choose what browsers do appear there on this "ballot" screen?
I saw in the pictures of this so-called "ballot" there is i.e. Flock.
WTF. That's not even a broser, more like browser's applet.
Sure, I agree it is good, K-Meleon and other "obscure" (LOL) browsers will benefit from better exposure, but again: it is important to know who is making the selections, who is to choose what browsers do appear there?
Because the same body may choose NOT TO show some browsers for whatever reason, and how do we fight that?
I hope it is not Msoft.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/06/2010 05:59AM by 888.
I'm not sure, but as it's a Microsoft responsive which has contact us, I think it's Microsoft.
A+
Mozilla/5.0 (x11; U; Linux x86_64; fr-FR; rv:38.0) Gecko/20100101 Ubuntu/12.04 K-Meleon/76.0
Web: http://jujuland.pagesperso-orange.fr/
Mail : alain [dot] aupeix [at] wanadoo [dot] fr
Ubuntu 12.04 - Gramps 3.4.9 - Harbour 3.2.0 - Hwgui 2.20-3 - K-Meleon 76.0 rc
No, and that would be nonsense, hm? According to the EU site in which I've digged around a bit (links from that MS guy), and it was also mentioned in some article, the choice depends strictly from the market share of a browser in the last (guess 6) months. They named 3 statistics websites that were relevant. Unfortunately on none of them I found KM, since the public pages don't list ALL browsers and versions, only those above a certain level, which KM didn't reach...
The funny thing is, those regulations also declared that all browsers using a trident engine were excluded, but perhaps they changed that again after some protest, or no idea...
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/06/2010 09:43AM by siria.
AFAIK MS runs the choice page. MS informed other small vendors they intend to do nothing after these had complained about layout - so Maxton & others petitioned to the EC.
What statistic can a browser like K-Meleon have when its users must spoof for full service on many sites while other sites count all Geckos as Firefox? Compare Yannis Kargas (disrupted) quoted abservations about spoofing in this coverage.
The whole choice screen smells fishy.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/06/2010 12:16PM by guenter.
Obviously enough to get on the choice screen
Must admit I was kinda surprised about this, but yet more when seeing recently on the sourceforge statistic (dorians link) that KM has an average of 2-4 thousand downloads per day :O
Spoofing, frankly I need it just about never, being not a member on pages like hotmail and facebook, and using my yahoo mail per pop3 in outlookexpress
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/06/2010 12:26PM by siria.
SÃ, asà es, es el mismo usuario y password para el foro, los bugs y las paginas wiki.
K-Meleon in Spanish
This still does not alter the fact that K-Meleon does not appear on the hotmail, Facebook and yahoo statstics. NO user, not even the ones going there leave K-Meleon's footprint in the statistics.
p.s. The whole choice screen smells fishy.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/06/2010 04:23PM by guenter.
Not surprising nor funny - I rechereched a little: Maxton received seeding capital.
Avant is tied to yahoo search.
I wonder whether their users have to spoof too?
p.s. The whole choice screen smells fishy.
I don't like to use c-net and k-meleon in the same sentence but I was glad to see the k-meleon user agent spoofing comments get coverage in the cnet article, didn't know that was Disrupted. By the way Guenter, I use Yahoo mail classic all the time with the default k-meleon user agent but just the other day I got THIS interstitial page when I logged in, suggesting I upgrade my browser. At the time I was accidentally using firefox2 user agent string, they suggested I upgrade firefox, then I switched to k-meleon and seamonkey strings and refreshed the page and they suggested I upgrade to the latest IE.
I also thought the STATS link was very interesting. I was impressed with the number of downloads and amused to see the difference between .exe and .7z versions (I'm a .7z person, and in the minority it seems).
1.) I did not expect CNET to cover K-Meleon's view of the problems.
Stephen Shankland contacted several ppl. Dorian delegated answer to others.
I voiced the same problems as disrupted (he has better English so he was heard).
2.) I use Yahoo new mail through the browser, so that we are warned when yahoo alters something. I also read US news there. I get this interesting page
when Autoswitcher does not react fast enough.
3.) kko informed me last year when K-Meleon had reached 1 million downloads in a year. SF is not the only download location. K-Meleon may have up to a million users - certainly has several 100thausend.
Forum usage also seemed to have increased - we have had more posts while the browser got better which theoretically would cause that less PPL need support
K-Meleon development related discussions.
CNET article on browser
Posted by:
aimutch
Date: February 26, 2010 02:09PM
CNET contacted me about an article that they are working on that includes questions about K-Meleon. Can someone from the current development team who could speak to them for the article contact me so I can get you in contact with them? E-mail me at my Yahoo e-mail (andrewimutch)
Re: CNET article on browser
Posted by:
guenter
Date: February 26, 2010 03:21PM
Devs and EC European translators (where i know mail) have Stephen Shankland's mail text with my comment about end user support and choice screen.
Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 02/26/2010 03:30PM by guenter.
Re: CNET article on browser
Posted by:
JujuLand
Date: February 26, 2010 03:44PM
I have send it to Dorian, and what I think of this (and to amutch, guenter, and all other devs)
I'm not the one which will answer, but in the mail I tell all what I think about these journalist (are-they really journalist ?)
I have send it in french, no problem to understand ?
A+
Mozilla/5.0 (x11; U; Linux x86_64; fr-FR; rv:38.0) Gecko/20100101 Ubuntu/12.04 K-Meleon/76.0
Web: http://jujuland.pagesperso-orange.fr/
Mail : alain [dot] aupeix [at] wanadoo [dot] fr
Ubuntu 12.04 - Gramps 3.4.9 - Harbour 3.2.0 - Hwgui 2.20-3 - K-Meleon 76.0 rc
Re: CNET article on browser
Posted by:
guenter
Date: February 26, 2010 05:10PM
None.
Quote
Stephen Shankland
I noticed the scroll bar in the selection window, but I'm sure many will overlook it. It's one reason I'm writing this story--to bring more attention to the browser choice design. There are other browsers besides the five on the first screen.
p.s. Stephen Shankland, senior writer at CNET News"
Deep Tech blog: http://news.cnet.com/deep-tech/
AFAIK You will find his coverage on Monday.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/26/2010 05:17PM by guenter.
Re: CNET article on browser
Posted by:
JujuLand
Date: February 26, 2010 05:16PM
I have read that the view order is aleatory, but just for the last 6 browsers, so you always arrive on the same screen with IE8, Opera, Firefox, Chrome, and Safari.
In the first screen it's not said that all the browsers aren't viewed in the same page. And we always arrive in this second screen where a great part of users won't see that there are others browsers.
It' really a scandal !!! That why Maxthon have respond.
Have we joined EC for this point ?
A+
Mozilla/5.0 (x11; U; Linux x86_64; fr-FR; rv:38.0) Gecko/20100101 Ubuntu/12.04 K-Meleon/76.0
Web: http://jujuland.pagesperso-orange.fr/
Mail : alain [dot] aupeix [at] wanadoo [dot] fr
Ubuntu 12.04 - Gramps 3.4.9 - Harbour 3.2.0 - Hwgui 2.20-3 - K-Meleon 76.0 rc
Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 02/26/2010 05:22PM by JujuLand.
Re: CNET article on browser
Posted by:
Alex.Tarantul
Date: February 26, 2010 07:20PM
I just wrote to Stephen Shankland my views on the merits. Although the ballot screen does not apply to Russian, but we have an opinion about this project and how it is implemented.
My blog about K-Meleon
http://kmeleon-ru.blogspot.com/
Re: CNET article on browser
Posted by:
Dorian
Date: February 26, 2010 07:30PM
I'm also concerned about all the other browser that doesn't figure in the list, and how they will be completely left out.
Anyways, the effects are showing up already. :O
Re: CNET article on browser
Posted by:
guenter
Date: February 26, 2010 08:03PM
Quote
Dorian
I'm also concerned about all the other browser that doesn't figure in the list, and how they will be completely left out.
Anyways, the effects are showing up already. :O
1.) I much agree - it would be easy to include more browsers if the ballot screen would scroll down normally.
2.) Maybe add Autoswitcher to 1.5.4 else many PPL will think that it is K-Meleon's fault that pages like Hotmail... do not work. Else we may get swamped with complaints.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/26/2010 08:03PM by guenter.
Re: CNET article on browser
Posted by:
desga2
Date: February 26, 2010 09:12PM
Quote
Dorian
I'm also concerned about all the other browser that doesn't figure in the list, and how they will be completely left out.
Anyways, the effects are showing up already. :O
But this growth is not really due only to the Browser Choice window, because this is in the same time that released of the new versions 1.5.4 RC and 1.6.0a.
K-Meleon in SpanishRe: CNET article on browser
Posted by:
disruted(unlogged)
Date: February 26, 2010 10:26PM
Quote
desga2
Quote
Dorian
I'm also concerned about all the other browser that doesn't figure in the list, and how they will be completely left out.
Anyways, the effects are showing up already. :O
But this growth is not really due only to the Browser Choice window, because this is in the same time that released of the new versions 1.5.4 RC and 1.6.0a.
no no, desga those are download statistics for the project page(files on kmeleon sf project) not website, 1.5.4rc and 1.6 are not yet on the project download at sf files and are hosted on the kmeleon website itself. so this increase is probably related to the choice screen. the choice srcreen install button sends directly to 1.5.3 download
Re: CNET article on browser
Posted by:
chrismt
Date: February 27, 2010 11:39AM
I hope someone will ask the CNET guy also to test K-Meleon 1.6
Re: CNET article on browser
Posted by:
Alex.Tarantul
Date: March 03, 2010 01:20PM
So, this is an article:
http://news.cnet.com/8301-30685_3-20000111-264.html
My blog about K-Meleon
http://kmeleon-ru.blogspot.com/
Re: CNET article on browser
Posted by:
slayer
Date: March 05, 2010 12:39AM
That is a very interesting article.
Personally I have tried Maxthon, SlimBrowser, Greenbrowser, Avant, Opera, and others now abandoned projects. Yes I have tried a lot of browsers. Most of those browser are IE based programs. I can not believe that the Maxthon representative says that can take Opera's place in the market? Opera is a robust browser with a large community. Currently Maxthon needs IE, and if you are using an old Windows OS you can't upgrade IE so...
Re: CNET article on browser
Posted by:
guenter
Date: March 05, 2010 01:16AM
Quote
slayer
That is a very interesting article.
Currently Maxthon needs IE, and if you are using an old Windows OS you can't upgrade IE so...
1.) EU gives obscure browsers a big chance by Stephen Shankland
I do not like the word: obscure
But IMHO You are right - he gives a balanced view of the pros and cons.
2.)Maxton with Gecko is called Orca. // sorry Avant see jsnj's coorection below.
Maxton with webkit will show up soon.
Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 03/06/2010 03:07AM by guenter.
Representatives of the 2nd tier browsers have complained to the EC.
Posted by:
guenter
Date: March 05, 2010 02:35PM
Lesser players seek browser choice prominence by Stephen Shankland quotes browser vendors that it "Is clear that the final choice screen design leaves the vast majority of users unaware that there are more than five browsers to choose from. This is inconsistent with the EU Commissions' stated goal for the choice screen--to provide European consumers with 'information on the 12 most widely-used Web browsers and to allow users to easily download and install one or more of these Web browsers,'"
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/05/2010 02:40PM by guenter.
Re: Representatives of the 2nd tier browsers have complained to the EC.
Posted by:
desga2
Date: March 06, 2010 01:08AM
Talking about press article, exist this old wiki page: PressCenter, that could be updated with some of the new articles about K-Meleon.
K-Meleon in SpanishRe: Representatives of the 2nd tier browsers have complained to the EC.
Posted by:
slayer
Date: March 06, 2010 01:43AM
@desga2 ¿Si te registrás en el foro, usás el mismo password y nombre de usuario para la wiki y todo lo demás? gracias de antemano.Quote
desga2
Talking about press article, exist this old wiki page: PressCenter, that could be updated with some of the new articles about K-Meleon.
Re: CNET article on browser
Posted by:
jsnj
Date: March 06, 2010 02:45AM
You mean Avant w/Gecko is Orca
Re: CNET article on browser
Posted by:
guenter
Date: March 06, 2010 03:06AM
Quote
jsnj
You mean Avant w/Gecko is Orca
Sorry and thx for correction.
Re: CNET article on browser
Posted by:
888
Date: March 06, 2010 05:59AM
But who is to choose what browsers do appear there on this "ballot" screen?
I saw in the pictures of this so-called "ballot" there is i.e. Flock.
WTF. That's not even a broser, more like browser's applet.
Sure, I agree it is good, K-Meleon and other "obscure" (LOL) browsers will benefit from better exposure, but again: it is important to know who is making the selections, who is to choose what browsers do appear there?
Because the same body may choose NOT TO show some browsers for whatever reason, and how do we fight that?
I hope it is not Msoft.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/06/2010 05:59AM by 888.
Re: CNET article on browser
Posted by:
JujuLand
Date: March 06, 2010 08:41AM
Quote
888
I hope it is not Msoft.
I'm not sure, but as it's a Microsoft responsive which has contact us, I think it's Microsoft.
A+
Mozilla/5.0 (x11; U; Linux x86_64; fr-FR; rv:38.0) Gecko/20100101 Ubuntu/12.04 K-Meleon/76.0
Web: http://jujuland.pagesperso-orange.fr/
Mail : alain [dot] aupeix [at] wanadoo [dot] fr
Ubuntu 12.04 - Gramps 3.4.9 - Harbour 3.2.0 - Hwgui 2.20-3 - K-Meleon 76.0 rc
Re: CNET article on browser
Posted by:
siria
Date: March 06, 2010 09:40AM
No, and that would be nonsense, hm? According to the EU site in which I've digged around a bit (links from that MS guy), and it was also mentioned in some article, the choice depends strictly from the market share of a browser in the last (guess 6) months. They named 3 statistics websites that were relevant. Unfortunately on none of them I found KM, since the public pages don't list ALL browsers and versions, only those above a certain level, which KM didn't reach...
The funny thing is, those regulations also declared that all browsers using a trident engine were excluded, but perhaps they changed that again after some protest, or no idea...
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/06/2010 09:43AM by siria.
Re: CNET article on browser
Posted by:
guenter
Date: March 06, 2010 11:41AM
Quote
siria
No, and that would be nonsense, hm? According to the EU site in which I've digged around a bit (links from that MS guy), and it was also mentioned in some article, the choice depends strictly from the market share of a browser in the last (guess 6) months. They named 3 statistics websites that were relevant.
AFAIK MS runs the choice page. MS informed other small vendors they intend to do nothing after these had complained about layout - so Maxton & others petitioned to the EC.
What statistic can a browser like K-Meleon have when its users must spoof for full service on many sites while other sites count all Geckos as Firefox? Compare Yannis Kargas (disrupted) quoted abservations about spoofing in this coverage.
The whole choice screen smells fishy.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/06/2010 12:16PM by guenter.
Re: CNET article on browser
Posted by:
siria
Date: March 06, 2010 12:19PM
Quote
guenter
What statistic can a browser like K-Meleon have when its users must spoof for full service on many sites while other sites count all Geckos as Firefox?
Obviously enough to get on the choice screen
Must admit I was kinda surprised about this, but yet more when seeing recently on the sourceforge statistic (dorians link) that KM has an average of 2-4 thousand downloads per day :O
Spoofing, frankly I need it just about never, being not a member on pages like hotmail and facebook, and using my yahoo mail per pop3 in outlookexpress
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/06/2010 12:26PM by siria.
Re: Representatives of the 2nd tier browsers have complained to the EC.
Posted by:
desga2
Date: March 06, 2010 02:50PM
Quote
slayer
@desga2 ¿Si te registrás en el foro, usás el mismo password y nombre de usuario para la wiki y todo lo demás? gracias de antemano.
SÃ, asà es, es el mismo usuario y password para el foro, los bugs y las paginas wiki.
K-Meleon in SpanishRe: CNET article on browser
Posted by:
guenter
Date: March 06, 2010 04:16PM
Quote
siria
Spoofing, frankly I need it just about never, being not a member on pages like hotmail and facebook, and using my yahoo mail per pop3 in outlookexpress
This still does not alter the fact that K-Meleon does not appear on the hotmail, Facebook and yahoo statstics. NO user, not even the ones going there leave K-Meleon's footprint in the statistics.
p.s. The whole choice screen smells fishy.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/06/2010 04:23PM by guenter.
Re: CNET article on browser
Posted by:
guenter
Date: March 06, 2010 04:52PM
Quote
siria
The funny thing is, those regulations also declared that all browsers using a trident engine were excluded, but perhaps they changed that again after some protest, or no idea...
Not surprising nor funny - I rechereched a little: Maxton received seeding capital.
Quote
Wikipedia
MyIE2 was renamed to Maxthon in 2004. It received seed funding from the first Skype investor Morten Lund, and WI Harper Group in 2005. In 2006 Maxthon received further investment from the US-based venture capital firm Charles River Ventures.
Avant is tied to yahoo search.
I wonder whether their users have to spoof too?
p.s. The whole choice screen smells fishy.
Re: CNET article on browser
Posted by:
Doon
Date: March 06, 2010 06:59PM
I don't like to use c-net and k-meleon in the same sentence but I was glad to see the k-meleon user agent spoofing comments get coverage in the cnet article, didn't know that was Disrupted. By the way Guenter, I use Yahoo mail classic all the time with the default k-meleon user agent but just the other day I got THIS interstitial page when I logged in, suggesting I upgrade my browser. At the time I was accidentally using firefox2 user agent string, they suggested I upgrade firefox, then I switched to k-meleon and seamonkey strings and refreshed the page and they suggested I upgrade to the latest IE.
I also thought the STATS link was very interesting. I was impressed with the number of downloads and amused to see the difference between .exe and .7z versions (I'm a .7z person, and in the minority it seems).
Re: CNET article on browser
Posted by:
guenter
Date: March 06, 2010 07:55PM
Quote
Doon
I don't like to use c-net and k-meleon in the same sentence but I was glad to see the k-meleon user agent spoofing comments get coverage in the cnet article, didn't know that was Disrupted.
By the way Guenter, I use Yahoo mail classic all the time with the default k-meleon user agent but just the other day I got THIS interstitial page when I logged in, suggesting I upgrade my browser. At the time I was accidentally using firefox2 user agent string, they suggested I upgrade firefox, then I switched to k-meleon and seamonkey strings and refreshed the page and they suggested I upgrade to the latest IE.
I also thought the STATS link was very interesting. I was impressed with the number of downloads and amused to see the difference between .exe and .7z versions (I'm a .7z person, and in the minority it seems).
1.) I did not expect CNET to cover K-Meleon's view of the problems.
Stephen Shankland contacted several ppl. Dorian delegated answer to others.
I voiced the same problems as disrupted (he has better English so he was heard).
2.) I use Yahoo new mail through the browser, so that we are warned when yahoo alters something. I also read US news there. I get this interesting page
when Autoswitcher does not react fast enough.
3.) kko informed me last year when K-Meleon had reached 1 million downloads in a year. SF is not the only download location. K-Meleon may have up to a million users - certainly has several 100thausend.
Forum usage also seemed to have increased - we have had more posts while the browser got better which theoretically would cause that less PPL need support
Re: Representatives of the 2nd tier browsers have complained to the EC.
Posted by:
slayer
Date: March 06, 2010 09:53PM
Thank you very much!Quote
desga2
Quote
slayer
@desga2 ¿Si te registrás en el foro, usás el mismo password y nombre de usuario para la wiki y todo lo demás? gracias de antemano.
SÃ, asà es, es el mismo usuario y password para el foro, los bugs y las paginas wiki.
English
